like if you can sober up long enough to start a thread on redacted ill spoon feed you setups to look for

[runatrain69]

Hey sonatine, I am not djchaps but I am interested in your prop trading propositions, especially the part where you can start with $200 - what do I gotta do to makea the maneys? TIA

[sonatine]

cool, the flow is basically this;

you sign up for a qualifying account at Apex, which is a well established player in the futures prop scene. i trade through them, ive cashed out through them, everything went off perfectly.

www.apextraderfunding.com

i have absolutely nothing to gain personally from suggesting you work through them btw, i dont get kickbacks if you dont sign up using my code and tbh i have no idea what/where my code is so yeah.

there are a ton of facebook groups that track what sales are going on and what their discount codes are. never pay full price for a qualifying account. coupon code SAVE50 provides a 50% discount and is valid like 90% of the year. SAVE80 is a 80% discount code, SAVE90 saves you 90%. those are active less but pop up regularly around holidays.

so yeah basically just as an example;

you sign up for a "$50k Account". you do so during a SAVE80 sale period and pay about $40.

you download Ninjatrader and some other software to trade through them and get your datafeed set up.

basically you have to turn $3000 worth of profit without to qualify for a paid account and you have to trade every day for 7 trading days.

hypothetically you can earn $3000 in one trade and then just make one tiny little trade every day for 6 more days, at which point you qualify for an actual live cash trading account.

you need to avoid taking $2500 in losses from your highest profit point. if you take more than $2500, they cancel the qualifying account and you have to start over by either resetting it or just buying a new account, whichever is cheaper.

if you get your $3000 profit and trade the full 7 trading days, they hand you a live account thats identical but youre trading actual whole ass live money with the same deal basically.

you pay $140 or something to 'graduate' the account at which point;

you have to trade for 10 trading days before you can cash out.

you can cash out once you have over $3000 profit in the account.

i think max cashout for the first 3 months is $2000 per account every 2 weeks / 10 trading days. after 3 months you can gut the account if you want.

so if you started today, the 17th, you would have a live cash account on the morning of the 29th.

your first available cashout window would be on Sep 15th, and you would see cash in your bank account by Oct 1.


oh also you can have up to 20 (!!!!!) accounts at once and trade them all in parallel using software so if youre good at this shit, you can cash out $80,000 a month.


there are also higher and lower base equity accounts.


fees / gotchas / how apex makes its money:

every time you place a trade, you pay a fee. i think its like between $2 and $5 per contract. that adds up if youre spewy and overtrading. apex charges a bit more than a normal cash broker.

when you cash out, the first 25k is 100% yours but after that, apex rakes 10%.

also a common question is 'but if i lose $2500 and i only paid $200 how does apex turn a profit' and the answer is, they run an alg that limits their exposure when your positions go against you. so it might look like you are down $10k on a position but apex actually closed your positions the second they went red, and will just open them without you noticing once they are in profit again.

so to you, you lost $10k. apex might only have lost grand or two plus they raked the contract fees and the registration fees and whatever reset fees, so they stay profitable regardless.


as to how to actually make money, you should head to youtube and study things like auction theory, order flow trading, so on. and just start following trading accounts on twitter that trade futures and arent shilling shitty discord groups.

for most people it takes a few years to start from zero and get the hang of it.

the general consensus is you wont get rich off trading futures but you can put together an incredibly comfortable life where you do nothing but beep boop from 9:30am EST to 10:30am EST a few days a week.

we can talk more about specific strats when you have a test account up and running.

[sonatine]

i actually need to spin up some fresh accounts so ill put together some videos documenting the process in the next few days.

[runatrain69]

fucking sweet dude I'm grinding out workaments today but will definitely get some shit started on here within the next few weeks

[sonatine]

a bit of risk/reward (RR) math:



3 bets a day for 2 weeks. win 20 / lose 10

$2500 bankroll. $125 = 5%.

1 contract / 2.25 point stop loss, 2.5 point take profit

10 losses = -1250

20 wins = +2500

net profit $1250, or $2500 a month, per $50,000 account.



note that they refer to accounts as $25,000 or $50,000 or $300,000. these numbers are weird marketing gimmicks. a $50,000 account comes with a $2500 drawdown. so they are giving you $2500 to gamble with, but a ludicrous amount of leverage/contracts. and thats the stinger; they give you rope to hang yourself. if you try to bet 10 contracts (the max allowed) at a time on a $2500 bankroll, statistically speaking youre fucking doomed.

pros never risk more than 5% of their bankroll on a bet.

so $2500 = $125 per bet. see above.


also i have to say if i had found this dudes videos 2 years ago id be preposterously wealthy by now;


https://www.youtube.com/@yuseftrades/videos

[Bob]

ok, so i'm going to do this today, with an 80% off code. the thing that's stopping me is all the ominous warnings. i understand most of them and it's cool, but then there are things like this one "Rithmic Accounts CAN NOT BE "converted" to Tradovate Accounts and Tradovate Accounts CAN NOT Be converted to Rithmic accounts. If you select the wrong connection OR the wrong plan it CAN NOT be switched or refunded for ANY Reason. You may trade both Rithmic and Tradovate Accounts, but they can not be converted from one to the other. This goes for Evaluations and PA's. You can not pass an evaluation using Rithmic and then choose to trade the resulting PA with Tradovate or vice-versa."

so anyway, just to confirm, do you suggest that i sign up for a "50K 10 Contracts Rithmic$167.00 for each month Rithmic 50K Full Size Account 10 Mini Contracts- Equal Full Ratio for Micros- on accounts purchased after 12/15/22, Profit goal $3000, Live Trailing Drawdown -$2500" account? and once i do, then what?

[sonatine]

ok, so i'm going to do this today, with an 80% off code. the thing that's stopping me is all the ominous warnings. i understand most of them and it's cool, but then there are things like this one "Rithmic Accounts CAN NOT BE "converted" to Tradovate Accounts and Tradovate Accounts CAN NOT Be converted to Rithmic accounts. If you select the wrong connection OR the wrong plan it CAN NOT be switched or refunded for ANY Reason. You may trade both Rithmic and Tradovate Accounts, but they can not be converted from one to the other. This goes for Evaluations and PA's. You can not pass an evaluation using Rithmic and then choose to trade the resulting PA with Tradovate or vice-versa."

so anyway, just to confirm, do you suggest that i sign up for a "50K 10 Contracts Rithmic$167.00 for each month Rithmic 50K Full Size Account 10 Mini Contracts- Equal Full Ratio for Micros- on accounts purchased after 12/15/22, Profit goal $3000, Live Trailing Drawdown -$2500" account? and once i do, then what?

so the 50k contracts have the best overall dynamics for starting out; they are the easiest to pass/graduate to a live account and offer the best potential for meaningful payouts.

obv use the 80% discount so youre paying like $33.95 to get it turned up.

im drowning in work bullshit at the moment but ill try to dig up a few basic videos that get into the basics and offer the greatest chance of turning profit fast. ill follow up tomorrow with em or just make one.

[Bob]

so the 50k contracts have the best overall dynamics for starting out; they are the easiest to pass/graduate to a live account and offer the best potential for meaningful payouts.

obv use the 80% discount so youre paying like $33.95 to get it turned up.

im drowning in work bullshit at the moment but ill try to dig up a few basic videos that get into the basics and offer the greatest chance of turning profit fast. ill follow up tomorrow with em or just make one.

for now i'm mostly concerned because i don't know the difference between a rithmic and a tradovate account and i don't want to get locked into the wrong thing. there are 50k accounts for both of them, with a few bucks difference in price. i'm googling the difference right now, but if you think i should definitely get one over the other i trust your judgement

[sonatine]

ahhhh sorry, right. tradeovate is a new trading platform they offer support for. the reason they are so alarmist is because countless people probably signed up for the wrong account or asked to change over etc etc and this is how they try to head that issue off.

you want rithmic. youll be trading on a platform called ninjatrader, they will cover the cost of the license and send you a reg code for it.

[Bob]

thanks brother bear, i got an account and did the various downloadings and setups

[sonatine]

FIRST OFF let this man run down the science.

[sonatine]

StEP ONE MAKE MONEY EVERY DAY

[sonatine]

i think im going to make a video this weekend because its just easier. it wont be anything too deep but it will be a good place to start fleshing out the basics.

[sonatine]

bobwell humor me how often are you up at like 9:00am and able to dick around on zoom for an hour or two?

[Bob]

like, not necessarily this weekend, but pretty much most days

[sonatine]

markets closed on weekends so no problem there, but next week ill try to set up a zoom channel during a morning session when youre around.

[Bob]

thanks man, I'll try to learn a little bit about how to operate ninja trader this weekend